CathedralCounty wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:53 pm

Free beer wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:47 pm

mad norm wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:25 pm

excessbee wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:11 pm

Nice one

Have a listen to today's PM on Radio 4, from 6 minutes before you jump on the band wagon.
A former head of the security services provides a surprisingly balanced counterpoint to cheap knee jerk reactions.

Mmmm on this one I don’t think I have much sympathy and pulling the boo hoo “I’m a young woman” card is a cheap trick - she wasn’t caught shoplifting she joined a murderous death cult

She was a fifteen years old child who was groomed for f@ck's sake. She is also or at least was a British citizen.

An Irishwoman called Lisa Smith did pretty much the same thing. She was in her 30s. There was never any question that the Irish state was responsible for her and had a duty to get her home. She was responsible for her actions, she was put on trial in Ireland and is now in prison. That is how decent countries deal with terrorists.

Of course there should be a sanction on Ms Bagum. But when States behave like the UK has, the terrorists win.

County4Life wrote: November 25th, 2022, 10:13 pm

Free beer wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:47 pm

mad norm wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:25 pm

excessbee wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:11 pm

Nice one

Have a listen to today's PM on Radio 4, from 6 minutes before you jump on the band wagon.
A former head of the security services provides a surprisingly balanced counterpoint to cheap knee jerk reactions.

Wtf...who lisyens to radio 4

I do for one, and I did listen the balanced article which was well presented.
But it did not change my mind about letting her back into the UK or having any sympathy for her.

As someone with a little professional knowledge about the case, I’m with Fu Ming - the lady isn’t fit to become a UK citizen so shouldn’t be allowed to enter the UK, she had destroyed her GN passport and so we shouldn’t issue her a new one.

DeePeeNCAFC wrote: November 26th, 2022, 12:15 am As someone with a little professional knowledge about the case, I’m with Fu Ming - the lady isn’t fit to become a UK citizen so shouldn’t be allowed to enter the UK, she had destroyed her GN passport and so we shouldn’t issue her a new one.

She was 15. If your 15 year old daughter was groomed and then went on to do some really bad things would you think it fair to leave her in a Syrian prison camp?

Well would you?

Is it about fairness? To me it's much more likely to be about setting an example in order that others don't follow the same route.
IIRC she was one of three 15 year old girls that set off, 2 chose a different course and are now back in the UK.

Stan A. Einstein wrote: November 26th, 2022, 1:05 am

DeePeeNCAFC wrote: November 26th, 2022, 12:15 am As someone with a little professional knowledge about the case, I’m with Fu Ming - the lady isn’t fit to become a UK citizen so shouldn’t be allowed to enter the UK, she had destroyed her GN passport and so we shouldn’t issue her a new one.

She was 15. If your 15 year old daughter was groomed and then went on to do some really bad things would you think it fair to leave her in a Syrian prison camp?

Well would you?

Morning Brendan,

If we all got our life path sorted from what we did when we were 15, I think a lot would all have problems and regrets. However, it is not just what she did when she was 15 is it? What she allegedly did when she was a few years older and a responsible adult is vile and degrading. That said, even tough she is not now a UK citizen, there is a case to be made that she should answer for her vile actions in a UK Court.

Stan A. Einstein wrote: November 26th, 2022, 12:01 am

CathedralCounty wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:53 pm

Free beer wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:47 pm

mad norm wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:25 pm

excessbee wrote: November 25th, 2022, 9:11 pm

Nice one

Have a listen to today's PM on Radio 4, from 6 minutes before you jump on the band wagon.
A former head of the security services provides a surprisingly balanced counterpoint to cheap knee jerk reactions.

Mmmm on this one I don’t think I have much sympathy and pulling the boo hoo “I’m a young woman” card is a cheap trick - she wasn’t caught shoplifting she joined a murderous death cult

She was a fifteen years old child who was groomed for f@ck's sake. She is also or at least was a British citizen.

An Irishwoman called Lisa Smith did pretty much the same thing. She was in her 30s. There was never any question that the Irish state was responsible for her and had a duty to get her home. She was responsible for her actions, she was put on trial in Ireland and is now in prison. That is how decent countries deal with terrorists.

Of course there should be a sanction on Ms Bagum. But when States behave like the UK has, the terrorists win.

As I said this isn’t some kid who’s been “led astray” to sell some weed or shoplift is it? And if it was a lad of 15 would that be viewed the same? I have sympathy for her and she should be forgiven BUT there has to be serious consequences too

All the comments here are well documented elsewhere. Personally, I have observed this UK government always baulking at tough decisions! This is just another example of their dismal record on human rights. This girl has been seriously let down by the UK, so convenient to strip citizenship & refuse re-entry. What do we do with criminals who flee to Spain or Brazil? Extradite them from where they are & try them in our courts. This person wants to face justice in her countries courts. The likes of Ronnie Biggs tried to avoid it. Can anyone explain to me the difference. Seems to me to be contrary to standard practice & abhorrent to boot. Shame on us!

Bonson&Hunt wrote: November 26th, 2022, 10:08 am All the comments here are well documented elsewhere. Personally, I have observed this UK government always baulking at tough decisions! This is just another example of their dismal record on human rights. This girl has been seriously let down by the UK, so convenient to strip citizenship & refuse re-entry. What do we do with criminals who flee to Spain or Brazil? Extradite them from where they are & try them in our courts. This person wants to face justice in her countries courts. The likes of Ronnie Biggs tried to avoid it. Can anyone explain to me the difference. Seems to me to be contrary to standard practice & abhorrent to boot. Shame on us!

I suspect that most of it is due to the colour of her skin.

Unfortunately this country is full of racists but not acknowledged. The current government a case in point.

pembsexile wrote: November 26th, 2022, 8:10 am

Stan A. Einstein wrote: November 26th, 2022, 1:05 am

DeePeeNCAFC wrote: November 26th, 2022, 12:15 am As someone with a little professional knowledge about the case, I’m with Fu Ming - the lady isn’t fit to become a UK citizen so shouldn’t be allowed to enter the UK, she had destroyed her GN passport and so we shouldn’t issue her a new one.

She was 15. If your 15 year old daughter was groomed and then went on to do some really bad things would you think it fair to leave her in a Syrian prison camp?

Well would you?

Morning Brendan,

If we all got our life path sorted from what we did when we were 15, I think a lot would all have problems and regrets. However, it is not just what she did when she was 15 is it? What she allegedly did when she was a few years older and a responsible adult is vile and degrading. That said, even tough she is not now a UK citizen, there is a case to be made that she should answer for her vile actions in a UK Court.

Morning Mike,

As you say allegedly. This is the point about human rights. They apply because we are human, not because we are angels. To what extent Ms Begum is responsible for whatever she may have done since becoming an adult should be decided in a court. Although if I were her defence brief I'd argue that once in Isis hands she wasn't exactly in a position to change her mind.

If she had been born Jane Smith with white skin and had a grandfather born in Denmark I doubt somehow the British government would be arguing she could be sent to Copenhagen on the basis that she could apply for Danish citizenship. But with brown skin and a grandfather from Bangladesh His Majesty's Government seem to think send her to a country 6,000 miles away is okay.

She comes across as an arrogant, entitled, and not particularly pleasant young woman. She is though a human being. The UK government is coming across as an arrogant, entitled, and frankly nasty regime. And lacking in humanity.

Don't always agree with Gary Neville but what he said about all the political stuff around the WC why is it always footballers brought into the lime light on these issues thousands of business men and women travel to these countries every day yet they don't have to put up with this nonsense.

The time to complain about Qatar getting the world cup was before they awarded it to them

Back to football. Another poor game this morning. I'm starting to think the quality of this tournament is not much better than League Two, certainly below Championship. With no real interest in the majority f teams, it's certainly less engaging.

UPTHEPORT wrote: November 26th, 2022, 12:53 pm Don't always agree with Gary Neville but what he said about all the political stuff around the WC why is it always footballers brought into the lime light on these issues thousands of business men and women travel to these countries every day yet they don't have to put up with this nonsense.

The time to complain about Qatar getting the world cup was before they awarded it to them

Awarding the World Cup to Qatar was as a result of FIFA officials taking bribes. The reason why footballers take the limelight is because millions of school children around the world will not be gathered around TV sets worshipping businessmen and businesswomen who travel to Qatar.

Gary Neville is embarrassed. And rightly so. When I behave in an arrogant, gutless, hypocritical manner, as we all do on occasions, I tend to talk bollocks as well.

Got evens on Lewandowski having one shot on target