Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
Re: Yma o hyd
2In my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (turning our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid a decision proved right the end of course).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
Last edited by CathedralCounty on November 14th, 2022, 3:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Yma o hyd
3CathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:50 pmIn my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (running our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
The fact that only 30% of people in Wales is down to our neighbours. It’s a reason why amazing songs like this exist.
Re: Yma o hyd
4Sorry, but you have missed the point of the song completely. Whoever plays the song in Wales, club/country, it is up to them. The song is a defence of the Welsh language. Despite what has happened to it, mostly by our near neighbours, it has survived. Tfft.CathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:50 pmIn my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (turning our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid a decision proved right the end of course).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
I have not seen any anti Welsh sentiment at all from our English friends on this messageboard, indeed, one of them has even posted in Welsh. I would hazard a guess that most of them like our attitude to the song. I have also never heard any anti Welsh sentiment recently from the National media whenever this is played. Quite the contrary.
There is absolutely nothing wrong at all with two individual countries belting out songs in their own language and then transferring that to the field. Sport is war without the deaths.
What people forget is that most of the people in modern Industrial Wales (me included) trace their ancestry from outside Wales. That doesn’t make us any less Welsh, just makes the speaking of it more difficult.
You are correct of course about the language in Newport and we certainly do play in the English league. It is a peculiarity of world sport that we play in a ‘foreign’ league with mostly English players and are certainly seen by the ‘foreign’ media as a Welsh club. Bloody brilliant and long may it remain so.
Re: Yma o hyd
5Welsh has been compulsory in schools in Wales for over 20 years but is no more widely spoken and probably more resented as a result - it’s a language that is useless in terms of commerce/internationally (Patagonia is hardly a stellar potential trading partner!) which largely explains the attitude towards it (it won’t get you a decent job outside of Wales and is useless when travelling) and is propped up by a cabal of middle class Welsh speakers and taxpayer funded bodies and [ironically] millions in UK government funds – I’m not anti-Welsh [language] but given 70% of people in Wales don’t speak or understand it is only part of what makes Wales Wales and the Welsh Welsh – it’s an undeniably beautiful lyrical language (hard to learn and very hard to master though more so because of the regional differences) which forms part of the story of Wales – its such a shame its being weaponized and sucks up millions of unnecessary funds in a way that Cornish, the Channel island patois or Scots does not – the obsession with it holds Wales back in my view – a debate for another day/forum methinks which is why we should stick to ‘County’ songs on match-days!Exile 1976 wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:53 pmCathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:50 pmIn my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (running our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
The fact that only 30% of people in Wales is down to our neighbours. It’s a reason why amazing songs like this exist.
Re: Yma o hyd
6What people forget is that most of the people in modern Industrial Wales (me included) trace their ancestry from outside Wales. That doesn’t make us any less Welsh, just makes the speaking of it more difficult.pembsexile wrote: November 14th, 2022, 4:15 pmSorry, but you have missed the point of the song completely. Whoever plays the song in Wales, club/country, it is up to them. The song is a defence of the Welsh language. Despite what has happened to it, mostly by our near neighbours, it has survived. Tfft.CathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:50 pmIn my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (turning our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid a decision proved right the end of course).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
I have not seen any anti Welsh sentiment at all from our English friends on this messageboard, indeed, one of them has even posted in Welsh. I would hazard a guess that most of them like our attitude to the song. I have also never heard any anti Welsh sentiment recently from the National media whenever this is played. Quite the contrary.
There is absolutely nothing wrong at all with two individual countries belting out songs in their own language and then transferring that to the field. Sport is war without the deaths.
What people forget is that most of the people in modern Industrial Wales (me included) trace their ancestry from outside Wales. That doesn’t make us any less Welsh, just makes the speaking of it more difficult.
You are correct of course about the language in Newport and we certainly do play in the English league. It is a peculiarity of world sport that we play in a ‘foreign’ league with mostly English players and are certainly seen by the ‘foreign’ media as a Welsh club. Bloody brilliant and long may it remain so.
That's sort of my point and maybe I've taken it personally BUT it does feel that the minority (30% of Wales that speaks Welsh) looks down on the [vast majority - 70%] of 'English speakers' who identify as Welsh as being somehow less Welsh than them - perhaps I've internalized it?! ironically I speak a 2nd language to an OK level everyday just not Welsh
Re: Yma o hyd
7I think it's the perfect song for County.
'In spite of everyone and everything, we are still here.'
'In spite of everyone and everything, we are still here.'
Re: Yma o hyd
8So you think that we should not teach it and just let out language die? Not me. Of course it should be taught in Welsh schools, I’m just glad my children get to learn the language, something I was wasn’t given the choice of in school.CathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 4:17 pmWelsh has been compulsory in schools in Wales for over 20 years but is no more widely spoken and probably more resented as a result - it’s a language that is useless in terms of commerce/internationally (Patagonia is hardly a stellar potential trading partner!) which largely explains the attitude towards it (it won’t get you a decent job outside of Wales and is useless when travelling) and is propped up by a cabal of middle class Welsh speakers and taxpayer funded bodies and [ironically] millions in UK government funds – I’m not anti-Welsh [language] but given 70% of people in Wales don’t speak or understand it is only part of what makes Wales Wales and the Welsh Welsh – it’s an undeniably beautiful lyrical language (hard to learn and very hard to master though more so because of the regional differences) which forms part of the story of Wales – its such a shame its being weaponized and sucks up millions of unnecessary funds in a way that Cornish, the Channel island patois or Scots does not – the obsession with it holds Wales back in my view – a debate for another day/forum methinks which is why we should stick to ‘County’ songs on match-days!Exile 1976 wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:53 pmCathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:50 pmIn my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (running our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
The fact that only 30% of people in Wales is down to our neighbours. It’s a reason why amazing songs like this exist.
Re: Yma o hyd
9This is nonsense for a start. I teach in schools in Wales and there has been significant improvement over the years. Not only that, but language learning apps have seen Welsh become one of the more popular languages to learn. Duolingo revealed that there were half a million active users learning Welsh not too long ago.CathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 4:17 pmWelsh has been compulsory in schools in Wales for over 20 years but is no more widely spoken and probably more resented as a result - it’s a language that is useless in terms of commerce/internationally (Patagonia is hardly a stellar potential trading partner!) which largely explains the attitude towards it (it won’t get you a decent job outside of Wales and is useless when travelling) and is propped up by a cabal of middle class Welsh speakers and taxpayer funded bodies and [ironically] millions in UK government funds – I’m not anti-Welsh [language] but given 70% of people in Wales don’t speak or understand it is only part of what makes Wales Wales and the Welsh Welsh – it’s an undeniably beautiful lyrical language (hard to learn and very hard to master though more so because of the regional differences) which forms part of the story of Wales – its such a shame its being weaponized and sucks up millions of unnecessary funds in a way that Cornish, the Channel island patois or Scots does not – the obsession with it holds Wales back in my view – a debate for another day/forum methinks which is why we should stick to ‘County’ songs on match-days!Exile 1976 wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:53 pmCathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:50 pmIn my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (running our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
The fact that only 30% of people in Wales is down to our neighbours. It’s a reason why amazing songs like this exist.
Also, what is often missed is that providing Welsh second-language education for children from 3-16 is key to helping those children develop consistent language learning skills. The UK as a whole is horrendous at teaching second languages, not helped by schools specialising in different languages that means some children learn French for a few years, before dropping it for German if they move school. In Wales, a child learns Welsh (although not the most global language) and all those language development skills consistently for the 12/13 years they spend in school. Don't worry though, they do learn other languages too! Although the years of learning French and German proved far less useful than the years of Welsh did for me!
Wales must be the only country in the world that has to justify using it's own language. The more bilingual we are, the better, unless one of the languages happens to be Welsh it seems!
Re: Yma o hyd
10Da iawn ti. Excellent post dispelling some of the myths about the language and its use and learning. A few other points I would like to emphasise as a born and bread Newportonian adult learner ( I only regard myself as having a basic standard of understanding and use of cymraeg) is that I have seen no sign of this cabal of middle class Welsh speakers, and have undoubtedly observed an increase in use of the language in the last 20 years. As for the difficulty in its learning, as it is almost entirely phonemic, with a far smaller vocabulary it is far easier to learn than English.DT1892 wrote: November 14th, 2022, 5:55 pmThis is nonsense for a start. I teach in schools in Wales and there has been significant improvement over the years. Not only that, but language learning apps have seen Welsh become one of the more popular languages to learn. Duolingo revealed that there were half a million active users learning Welsh not too long ago.CathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 4:17 pmWelsh has been compulsory in schools in Wales for over 20 years but is no more widely spoken and probably more resented as a result - it’s a language that is useless in terms of commerce/internationally (Patagonia is hardly a stellar potential trading partner!) which largely explains the attitude towards it (it won’t get you a decent job outside of Wales and is useless when travelling) and is propped up by a cabal of middle class Welsh speakers and taxpayer funded bodies and [ironically] millions in UK government funds – I’m not anti-Welsh [language] but given 70% of people in Wales don’t speak or understand it is only part of what makes Wales Wales and the Welsh Welsh – it’s an undeniably beautiful lyrical language (hard to learn and very hard to master though more so because of the regional differences) which forms part of the story of Wales – its such a shame its being weaponized and sucks up millions of unnecessary funds in a way that Cornish, the Channel island patois or Scots does not – the obsession with it holds Wales back in my view – a debate for another day/forum methinks which is why we should stick to ‘County’ songs on match-days!Exile 1976 wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:53 pmCathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:50 pmIn my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (running our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
The fact that only 30% of people in Wales is down to our neighbours. It’s a reason why amazing songs like this exist.
Also, what is often missed is that providing Welsh second-language education for children from 3-16 is key to helping those children develop consistent language learning skills. The UK as a whole is horrendous at teaching second languages, not helped by schools specialising in different languages that means some children learn French for a few years, before dropping it for German if they move school. In Wales, a child learns Welsh (although not the most global language) and all those language development skills consistently for the 12/13 years they spend in school. Don't worry though, they do learn other languages too! Although the years of learning French and German proved far less useful than the years of Welsh did for me!
Wales must be the only country in the world that has to justify using it's own language. The more bilingual we are, the better, unless one of the languages happens to be Welsh it seems!
Don't get the apparent criticism of the language as not being of use in getting you a job outside of Wales! What percentage of the population are looking for one? Yet it's use is often an advantage for the majority who only look for work within Wales.
Just to clarify there are far more Welsh speakers in England than in Patagonia.
Back to the topic heading, I think it's recent playing of it at the County is primarily because of it's adoption as the official Wales world cup song. I'm quite confident the majority of County supporters would regard themselves as Welsh and supportive of the national team, despite feeling quite alone in my section of the crowd when singing along to it. Not a member of the middle class cabal in sight.
Re: Yma o hyd
11I think its a rousing song that is entirely appropriate to play at Rodney Parade because one, we are a Welsh
side and two, as has been said despite it all we as a football club are still here
side and two, as has been said despite it all we as a football club are still here
Re: Yma o hyd
12Regardless of what is it about or what it represents I am not a fan when played at Newport games. We have no tradition association with it, not to say that should stop it becoming tradition, but just seems to be jumping on the bandwagon. We have Run Lads Shoot Lads as a Newport song, play that instead. And the least said about Hi Ho Silver the better.
Re: Yma o hyd
13My granddaughter has just started at Welsh nursery I'm very proud.
Two of my colleagues are flaunt Welsh speakers both from the Newport area having been educated in Welsh language schools
I think it's fantastic and I'm going to try a learn myself to hopefully help my grandchildren
Two of my colleagues are flaunt Welsh speakers both from the Newport area having been educated in Welsh language schools
I think it's fantastic and I'm going to try a learn myself to hopefully help my grandchildren
Re: Yma o hyd
14Two of my colleagues are flaunt Welsh speakers both from the Newport area [/quote wrote:
If you’ve got it, flaunt it
Re: Yma o hyd
15Not what I'm saying at all - teach it up to primary level by all means (not forgetting the ever popular Welsh medium schools are an option too) - but in terms of commerce and future of the youth of Wales - any number of other languages (mandarin Chinese?) would be of far greater help in getting ahead as an individual and as a country - the romanticism around the language holds us back and forgets that despite the huge push for it it’s still a minority language - it should be supported (if for no other reason other than it IS a minority language) but not foisted upon people nor seen as the coat peg on which to hang the hat of Wales on.Exile 1976 wrote: November 14th, 2022, 5:48 pmSo you think that we should not teach it and just let out language die? Not me. Of course it should be taught in Welsh schools, I’m just glad my children get to learn the language, something I was wasn’t given the choice of in school.CathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 4:17 pmWelsh has been compulsory in schools in Wales for over 20 years but is no more widely spoken and probably more resented as a result - it’s a language that is useless in terms of commerce/internationally (Patagonia is hardly a stellar potential trading partner!) which largely explains the attitude towards it (it won’t get you a decent job outside of Wales and is useless when travelling) and is propped up by a cabal of middle class Welsh speakers and taxpayer funded bodies and [ironically] millions in UK government funds – I’m not anti-Welsh [language] but given 70% of people in Wales don’t speak or understand it is only part of what makes Wales Wales and the Welsh Welsh – it’s an undeniably beautiful lyrical language (hard to learn and very hard to master though more so because of the regional differences) which forms part of the story of Wales – its such a shame its being weaponized and sucks up millions of unnecessary funds in a way that Cornish, the Channel island patois or Scots does not – the obsession with it holds Wales back in my view – a debate for another day/forum methinks which is why we should stick to ‘County’ songs on match-days!Exile 1976 wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:53 pmCathedralCounty wrote: November 14th, 2022, 3:50 pmIn my view NOT [a great choice] its a Wales not a County song and feeds into the old and frankly boring 'Wales v England' trope which is tiresome especially as a good 15-20% of our fans live in or come from England - stick to County songs or good indie tunes - its not even a particularity good song and is sort of an odd choice as only less than 30% of Wales' (far, far less % in Newport) population speak or understand Welsh and we play in the English football league (running our back at great cost on the Welsh pyramid).Chepstow'sFine wrote: November 14th, 2022, 1:01 pm Anyone else get goose-bumps when this comes on before a game? Great choice by the club.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBQAvAFjus
The fact that only 30% of people in Wales is down to our neighbours. It’s a reason why amazing songs like this exist.
[edit] I'm NOT anti Welsh [language] but it plays no part in my life as it doesn't for the 70% (not a fixed % and likely that over time numbers of Welsh speakers will slowly increase albeit immigration will mean more English speakers come in) in Wales who don't speak or understand it I have no desire to learn it and don't consider myself any less Welsh for that - the second language I do speak [i.e., not Welsh and not that well I admit!] is far more important to me as I use it at home everyday.
I do want to make it really clear that I had no intention of insulting or upsetting those Welsh speakers on here and am upset that I may have done so - as noted, albeit via marriage, I totally get the need to keep a language/culture/food alive amid the flood of homogenization I just feel we have need a more practical and honest approach to Welsh and not exclude non welsh speakers either (the much cited by me '70%' of us in Wales) - as noted before we don't always agree on this forum but we are all County fans and can metaphorically shake hands on that at least.
Last edited by CathedralCounty on November 15th, 2022, 9:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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